amplifier direction question

[pmkkdx]

hi again ... I have another question (maybe several as I dig deeper). We have had 2 different sound guys give us bids with options ... Checking my trusty braintrust here on TT

We are now looking at replacing the radio or head unit as some might refer. We have the Clarion head unit that I believe to be the original for 2004 X2 (205v). The add on bluetooth we added a couple years back when I started this thread is fluky and frequently doesn't connect. We would love to still have CD capability but I think I have my wife consoled to merely radio & streaming from phone via bluetooth with an upgraded head unit. by talking to the sound guys, I also need to replace the original Clarion remote by the helm.

What recommendations do ya'll have for replacement head unit??? (recommendations are Kenwood KMR328BT or Fusion MS-RA670)

second question, back to the second amp to drive the tower 4x Wetsounds Rev 8's. sound guys recommendation is JL m800/8, I believe the discussion was to bridge to maximize the power to drive the Rev 8's.

again, what recommendations do ya'll have???


also add on option recommendation was for a power capacitor to keep consistent power to prolong life of amp???

[MLA]

Clarion M608 and MW1 remote would be my choice along with a Fusion Apollo series.

Amp for Rev-8; The Wet Sounds Syn-DX2.3HP retails for $1100, will reliver up to 300W RMS and only requires a single pair of RCA. The M800/8 retails for $1050 and at its full potential (bridged 4 chnl with all chnls at 2 ohm) is just hitting the speaker's RMS of 200W and to bridge correctly, needs to have all 8 inputs populated, which requires 6 RCA splitters.

Add additional battery capacity. In 13 years, ive never installed a capacitor in a boat, but have removed a few and tossed them in the trash.

[pmkkdx]

thanks MLA!!!

by looking at the Clarion M608 ($400) & MW1 remote, looks like that is a wired remote? I am guessing a new wire harness or new wires (plus labor)?

where the Fusion MS-RA607 ($450) uses a wireless remote?

side by side comparison, should I take into consideration the below?

RMS power Fusion 26 watts, Clarion 18 watts
Peak output Fusion 70 watts, Clarion 50
preamp outputs Fusion 9 channel, Clarion 6 channel
Preamp voltage Fusion 5.5 volts, Clarion 4 volts

(comparison was from side by side in Crutchfield, link doesn't work right)

as for Amp, does JL offer something similar capability (notice I didn't say size, since that kept confusing me last time) to the Wet Sounds Syn-DX2.3HP? (just trying to keep both amps the same brand). Also the first sound guy recommended the JL M800/8, the second sound guy was giving apples to apples comparison on amp, so I am not stuck on the M800/8.

[MLA]

RMS power Fusion 26 watts, Clarion 18 watts
Peak output Fusion 70 watts, Clarion 50

Misleading as one is peak and one is RMS. Id say real world volume would be the same from boat. However, its moot if all speakers are powered by external amps.

preamp outputs Fusion 9 channel, Clarion 6 channel

The fusion has a woofer output for each of its 3 volume zones. Not relevant unless you have a large cabin or houseboat and need each zone to have its own woofer tied to that zone's volume level.

Preamp voltage Fusion 5.5 volts, Clarion 4 volts

4v is already 2X what your current head unit is delivering, so both would be an improvement and you would notice a difference in a side x side test.

The Fusion wireless has no display, where are the Clarion's hard wire remote has a display and shows you most of what you would see on the main unit. Not sure if you old remote is round, rectangle or oval, but Clarion also offer the MW3 rectangle remote. One of these could be a near plug n play replacement for the existing remote. If its not retired, the MF2 wifi adaptor lets your phone be a wireless remote.

When using the MF2, I prefer to use an old phone thats not active. Much easier to leave it on the remote app compared to going back and forth between the remote app and your music app.

JL does not offer a 2 chnl that will deliver anywhere near the wattage of the Syn-DX2.3HP. If you want to stay with JL, then I would go with the MV600/2 over the bridged 4 chnl M800/8. The MV600/2 will deliver 150W rms to each speaker and thats not an audible difference compared to the bridged 200W from the M800/8

[pmkkdx]

my head is starting to hurt and will need to dig back thru some paper documentation that hopefully my wife kept from 2 years ago as I dig deeper.

easy part first, the current remote is an oval Clarion:

[pmkkdx]

now the not so easy part that totally escaped my memory ... the 2nd amp that drives the towers is not the older Memphis that I was thinking, we evidently replaced that during the process 2 years ago also.

I decided to take a peek when I was taking a picture of the remote is when I realized that amp was not the old Memphis.

so... the amp that drives the 4x Rev 8's on the tower is an NVX VAD8402, and the description I am finding online is that it is a 2 Channel 840 watts RMS. I am guessing in reading back thru this entire thread, it was one of the recommendations via private message and I forgot to capture that here on the thread. So, maybe I don't need to replace after all???

I did find a spot on one of the tower speakers that has a crackling sound where the wires were pinched where the clamp attaches to the tower cross tube, and am starting to wonder if that might have cut thru the insulation enough to cause a ground that blew the fuses on that amp. I need to remove that speaker to check that wiring.

so (keeping fingers crossed) we may only need a head unit and replacing the helm remote ...

[MLA]

Wattage wise, that nvx will deliver 210W rms to each speaker. So build quality aside, there is no advantage to the wattage of either JL amp mentioned here.

If the conductors are shorted, it typically puts the amp into protect mode, and would effect both speakers on the chnl. Given the price point of that amp, I doubt it can shut down an individual chnl, so it would likely shut down both channels, causing all the tower speakers to go quite.

I would not expect a shorted speaker lead to cause the amp's on-board fusing to blow.

[pmkkdx]

hmmm, that amp has 2x 40 amp fuses. At one minute, the tower was sounding fine, the poof, nothing. after getting home, I checked to see if there was something wrong and found both of those 40 amp fuses blown. I picked up 2 new fuses, plugged them in and everything sounded fine other than a little buzzing/crackling noise from one speaker ... upon inspection is when I found the pinched wire. That same trip out we could not get the add-on bluetooth to connect to neither my wife or my phones. That's when she called the sound guys to give us a quote. One guy came out and crawled thru the entire system and gave us the recommendation of the Kenwood head & remote, new JL m800/8 bridged to drive the 4 Rev 8s, and trouble shooting wiring throughout the tower.

wife wanted a 2nd opinion is when the 2nd guy basically quoted us the same thing but threw out his preferred option of the Fusion head unit & remote, which was comparable on same and a bit higher with Fusion and also threw out the idea of the capacitor.

[MLA]

Address the pinched wire and see if the unwanted noise goes away, then go from there. My gut says the noise will still be there, why? The 2 speakers on that side are wired as one, so to speak, as they are both powered by the same amp channel. If the short causes noise in one, it would likely induce the noise in both speakers.

[pmkkdx]

interesting ... we only hear the buzzing/crackling on one speaker, the one where I found the pinched wire. I will have to investigate closer, just found that.

back to amp that drives the towers ... is the NVX amp, ample for the towers?

I will take the above comments regarding the comparison between the Clarion and Fusion head units back to both sound guys to get their thoughts or rebuttal. As of now, I am leaning to the Clarion as I think the remote being wired with digital would be better for us.

[waterlogged882]

MLA is your sound guy.

.

[pmkkdx]

MLA is your sound guy.

.

he has helped me tremendously to where I can almost understand all this stuff ...

[MLA]

interesting ... we only hear the buzzing/crackling on one speaker, the one where I found the pinched wire. I will have to investigate closer, just found that.

back to amp that drives the towers ... is the NVX amp, ample for the towers?

I will take the above comments regarding the comparison between the Clarion and Fusion head units back to both sound guys to get their thoughts or rebuttal. As of now, I am leaning to the Clarion as I think the remote being wired with digital would be better for us.

Purely from a wattage standpoint, the current nvx is going to deliver the same wattage as the JL M800/8 or MV600/2. So if the nvx is working as it should, you will not gain in volume.

An amp like that Syn-DX2.3HP that offers a great deal more wattage, means we get peak wattage to the speaker, but at a lower gain level setting on the amp. This has the amp running more conservative. This can = better sound quality.

The Fusion also supports a wired remote that has a display. One key advantage to the fusion wired remote v's the clarion, is that the zone control is accessible on the fusion wired remote.

[Yellow X9]

I'm a big JL Audio Fan, where amps are concerned, the XD series I use the following JL Products in my 06-X9
2- JL XD 8008
1- JL XD 1001
1 JL- Media Master - Head unit w/ BT- with remote control pod on the Drivers side and 4 volt output on the Audio out-puts
2, JL - 13TW5 Subs
1, JL Tweak 88 to dial in the system
4, Rev 10"s on the tower
1, JL Free Air 10 under the drivers dash- more used for lower Mid bass freq- 120hz - 220hz
3 pair JL 770's
I run 3 batteries- never had dead batteries
Also built in a 3 bank battery maintainer
Very loud and most importantly- Clean Sound
The Tweak 88- allows me to fine tune the system, most importantly tune down the the horn loaded highs in the Rev 10's

[pmkkdx]

thanks, this is the first time I have had a minute today to read here. Great suggestions and make me rethink the original thoughts coming back to this thread yesterday. I will compile a bunch of data and come up with a new plan of attack tomorrow ... get back with both sound guys to bounce off of them and get them to requote. again, thanks!!!