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  • CantRepeat
    replied
    In before, what’s the golf tee for?!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • dpb185
    replied
    Originally posted by jj91 View Post
    Install is done. As usual it took a bit longer than expected but overall went pretty smooth. I'm not going to miss crawling around under the observer seat. My a** is too big and too old to be doing much more of that. Overall I'm happy with the results.

    I got my cables from Greg's Marine Wire Supply (also sells under Custom Boat Cables and Lawrence Marine)...everything at Genuinedealz was out of stock. They seem like top quality cables, service was fast, and the reviews I found were very good.

    Appreciate everyone's help!
    This is another project on my list. A question, did you have Greg's make up your cables or did you make them up yourself ? And what gauge cables did you use ?

    Leave a comment:


  • waterlogged882
    replied
    Originally posted by jj91 View Post
    Good eye! You're right there is no power wire from the ACR. From the directions and my discussion with Blue Sea that power wire from the ACR to the ignition is optional. My understanding is that it would disengage the ACR during starting to prevent a voltage drop on the house side that could cause electronics (i.e. depth finder, plotter, etc.) on that side to reboot. I guess I wasn't concerned with that and it sounded like a high percentage of people don't hook that up. In my brief lake test I didn't notice any sort of drop that affected electronics. I've followed this forum long enough to know you know far more about all things boats than me. Do you see a risk? I guess I could always add it if I notice issues.
    No risk, just preference. I like the option because it allows the ACR to work like it is designed (to monitor each battery with appropriate actions). It is almost fool proof with the option.

    Here is a good read if the notion hits you. It is long and tedious but once or twice through is enlightening, where the take-away is that what you have is not (technically) an isolation relay but it is a charging monitor (relay) per se'...thus the option.

    Your project looks good. Thanks for the kind words but I assure you there is a lot I do not know, thus I like to come here and read and learn.

    Best

    .

    Leave a comment:


  • jj91
    replied
    Good eye! You're right there is no power wire from the ACR. From the directions and my discussion with Blue Sea that power wire from the ACR to the ignition is optional. My understanding is that it would disengage the ACR during starting to prevent a voltage drop on the house side that could cause electronics (i.e. depth finder, plotter, etc.) on that side to reboot. I guess I wasn't concerned with that and it sounded like a high percentage of people don't hook that up. In my brief lake test I didn't notice any sort of drop that affected electronics. I've followed this forum long enough to know you know far more about all things boats than me. Do you see a risk? I guess I could always add it if I notice issues.

    Leave a comment:


  • waterlogged882
    replied
    Originally posted by jj91 View Post
    Install is done. As usual it took a bit longer than expected but overall went pretty smooth. I'm not going to miss crawling around under the observer seat. My a** is too big and too old to be doing much more of that. Overall I'm happy with the results.

    I got my cables from Greg's Marine Wire Supply (also sells under Custom Boat Cables and Lawrence Marine)...everything at Genuinedealz was out of stock. They seem like top quality cables, service was fast, and the reviews I found were very good.

    Appreciate everyone's help!
    Looks good. Almost appears that you do not have a hot wire to the ACR but I think it is the photo. I see the fuse that runs to the accessory post. You need the hot feed coming from the start position on the ignition switch. Constant 12V will lock out the ACR and not allow for combining. Hard to make out how the ACR is wired for remote operation. There should be two wires (16GA) coming from bottom of the ACR (hot and ground).

    .
    Last edited by waterlogged882; 05-11-2021, 06:41 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • jj91
    replied
    Install is done. As usual it took a bit longer than expected but overall went pretty smooth. I'm not going to miss crawling around under the observer seat. My a** is too big and too old to be doing much more of that. Overall I'm happy with the results.

    I got my cables from Greg's Marine Wire Supply (also sells under Custom Boat Cables and Lawrence Marine)...everything at Genuinedealz was out of stock. They seem like top quality cables, service was fast, and the reviews I found were very good.

    Appreciate everyone's help!
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • jj91
    replied
    I hear what your saying. I took up the rear floor panel and there was some extra cable tied up next to the fuel cell so good news is I think I can move the bus bar from my original design to another spot and have enough cable to get there. Again, appreciate the response.
    Last edited by jj91; 04-12-2021, 04:07 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • D2Dominator
    replied
    The way I see it, you have two options:

    1. Snake a new ground next to the other wiring harness if you need to replace the cable.
    2. Take your existing ground, terminate it at a bus bar near the existing battery, and use that bus bar to connect your myriad of grounds.

    The key to all of your connections will be to have robust, clean connections at all grounds. Make sure that terminal studs and ring ends are the right size, and are free of corrosion.


    I would not use a circuit breaker on your ground lead. This is the wrong application.

    D2

    Leave a comment:


  • jj91
    replied
    Ok, so I spent some time measuring cables and planning out my design. I thought it was going to be easy to pull the ground wire from my accessories under the helm to the battery as I need to extend that wire. Whoa, I guess not. Positive and negative cables along with 4-5 other wiring harnesses are all taped together inside of some corrugated tubing. Once it gets back to the fuel tank the P and N wires split to go the battery while the other wires continue to the engine. I'm afraid if I pull them it's going to be one heck of battle to get them back through the hole behind the kick plate.

    I'm not sure why I didn't think of this earlier...would have saved me some time and a cut above my eye (lol...dropped phone on my head as I was crawling under there trying to get some light), but can't I just add another circuit breaker next to the positive one already I have by my battery (see pic below). Then I can attach the existing negative wire from the breaker and put a new wire from the breaker to buss bar...effectively lengthening the wire. I get that will result in 2 breakers on the same circuit, but would that cause any issues/concerns?
    Attached Files
    Last edited by jj91; 04-11-2021, 11:24 PM.

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  • D2Dominator
    replied
    Originally posted by jj91 View Post
    D2 appreciate the response. Sorry for all the questions. I'm definitely a newbie when it comes to this. So I can just run this wire and everything on it to the House Battery? I'm not sure I understand your comment on the ECM. Other than running the power and ground from the starter to the starter battery is there anything else that needs to go to the starter battery?

    No problem, we've all been there.

    I would run the house cable that is connected to that breaker (you probably want to confirm, I don't know how your boat was configured) as well as any amps, stereo & accessories to the house battery. Typically the house will be a deep cycle battery BTW.

    The cable running to the starter probably also serves the ECM (engine control module) which is likely on its own breaker near or on the engine.

    Starter battery should only serve the vitals that need to start the engine, so the Starter and ECM.

    The intent is that the Blue seas system will isolate your house battery from the starter battery when the system voltage falls below the alternator output. If I recall, this is 12.4 volts for 10 seconds. Once the alternator starts outputting over 13.6 volts, it will combine the batteries so that the house charges along side the starter.

    Your best bet would be to draw the system out, and make sure you have all your ducks in a row before starting to move anything around the boat.

    This is all off memory... so if i've misstated anything, someone jump in.

    Hope this helps,
    -D2

    Leave a comment:


  • jj91
    replied
    D2 appreciate the response. Sorry for all the questions. I'm definitely a newbie when it comes to this. So I can just run this wire and everything on it to the House Battery? I'm not sure I understand your comment on the ECM. Other than running the power and ground from the starter to the starter battery is there anything else that needs to go to the starter battery?

    Leave a comment:


  • D2Dominator
    replied
    Couple things here:

    - The whole purpose of installing the BS ACR is to eliminate or lessen the chance that you are stuck without enough power to turn off the engine. Your starter battery should only have the starter connected (and the ECM in our cases) with everything else on the House. Otherwise, your accessories can/will drain your starter battery.

    -If the 40 AMP breaker is functioning, no reason to replace it now.

    -Generally, fuses/breakers should be installed as close to the battery for every run of wire. These are not to protect the battery necessarily (even though they help) but rather to prevent the cable from overheating and catching fire in case amperage exceeds the capability of the cable. This could happen if one batteries voltage is vastly different than another, or an internal short, or a short to ground. I have breakers to eliminate needing to swap fuses, but you could just as easily have a couple 100amps on hand.

    -If a fuse were to blow between the ACR and one of the batteries, the starter battery would till function, but the house would not be recharged. Remember, you could override the system and combine both batteries. The chances of blowing a fuse here is really low... Something would really have to have gone wrong.

    I think I hit everything?

    -D2


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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  • jj91
    replied
    Hey guys, thanks for the feedback. I will go with the recommended approach from Blue Seas.

    A couple other questions before I start...trying to get my parts list figured out:

    • I assume the 40 amp breaker (pic below) goes to my accessories control/fuse box under the dash. I’m looking to keep my wiring simple and not break out or rewire stuff (i.e. run the amp and tower speakers on the separate battery). In that case is it best to wire this direct to my starter battery (since it would include my bilge pumps) or is it better to wire to the load side of the switch? If I wire to the load side can I combine this and the starter power wire on the same terminal on the switch or do I need to run through some sort of power distribution block?

    • I assume this 40 amp breaker is original…since I’m doing some rewiring does it pay to switch it out or better to not mess with it?

    • I believe the Blue Seas schematic shows a there should be a fuse on both the starter and house battery connections going to the ACR. What happens if that fuse blows? Would that only affect the ACR functionality and result in either both batteries receiving (or not receiving) a charge?
    Attached Files
    Last edited by jj91; 04-07-2021, 02:53 PM.

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  • waterlogged882
    replied
    Originally posted by D2Dominator View Post
    This is a follow up for my 2002 Xstar (205v):

    Charging lead (orange) runs from the alternator to the starter. The orange lead is combined with a red lead in a single 3/8 ring terminal: this should be 5/16.

    The red lead feeds the 50amp engine breaker.

    The alternator ground terminates at the starboard 3/8 lug forward engine lug.

    2awg power cable runs from the starter to the battery switch along side a 2awg ground cable that terminates at the port 3/8 engine lug.

    House electric from under dash by way of 2 6awg cables that travel behind the kick panel, through the bilge and into the batter compartment under the passenger observer seat.

    I’m going to replace the charging cable and alternator ground with appropriately sized cable and ring ends. The 3/8 lugs are grossly oversized for the alternator and starter bolts.

    I’m going to leave the engine breaker attached directly to the starter, and connect the amps, radio, and dash fuse panel to the house battery. This should be a simple method of isolating the house and engine... I’m going to use the blue seas ACR.

    My factory setup had the battery’s run in parallel, with all the grounds terminating at one of the battery’s 5/16 ground post, and the red leads attached to the PERKO switch. I’ve installed a 4 x 3/8 studded ground bus bar and run appropriate cables and lugs to the batteries, house bus bar, amps, and engine block.

    Next step is to install the add a battery kit, but the system is already cleaner... I’m surprised MC installed lugs that are so mismatched in size. The engine ground was an oval after 20 years!

    Hope this specificity helps someone.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    The only thing I would comment is the Perko switch. Get rid of it and replace with Blue Seas, but maybe that is your intent with the new kit to include the isolation relay.

    Everything else is spot on. The 4 lug common ground will prevent a ground loop. Good call on that.

    .

    Leave a comment:


  • waterlogged882
    replied
    Originally posted by D2Dominator View Post
    This is going back a bit in my memory bank... but maybe it will spark some conversation. The load that could be "Parasitic" would be better better managed with a switch externally to the kit IMO. I've used the BS configuration as described in their manual and have never had trouble.

    Best,
    D2
    Originally posted by bturner2 View Post
    Same here. I don't mess with what the EEs at a company that designs these and systems for very large installations recommend.
    +3 ^

    The Blue Seas schematic works just fine like it is intended.

    .

    Leave a comment:

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