Porsche Gurus - Insight Requested!

[d2jp]

Hello Fellow TTer's - Looking for some 'real world' input here. Window shopping and test driving in search of a driver quality 911 as a weekender. Started looking at 3.2s exclusively (coupes and targas,mostly 86-88). Then the 996 entered the picture. I've driven both air-cooled and water-cooled. My heart's in air-cooled but the water-cooled have their own merits and right now, a lower cost of entry for a nicely equipped, low mileage, documented car. But.......theM96/97 engine stories of IMS failure and more recently 'bore-scoring' has me in search of more information. The IMS is something I could replace, so no long-term concerns there just going to budget a weekend and $1k-$3k for parts. Bore-scoring is a lot more concerning to me. I feel I've reached the end of the internet in researching this topic and still can't determine is this a "100% chance" I'm in for a $20K+ rebuild in the future, assuming I drive a car from 40,000 miles to well over 100k miles? I'm on Rennlist and Pelican reading and learning. Some 996 owners have engine failures at 100k or well under. Others are over 150k miles w just regular maintenance.
Any TT owners of 996s, Boxsters or Caymens or anyone with first hand experience or knowledge care to chime in?
Is this internet hysteria based on a few vendors making money on rebuilds or in the long run, do I just buy a well-sorted air cooled and eliminate at least one wallet-emptying repair scenario?

[h_2_o]

that is a discussion that will not give you a good answer IMHO. Mostly because everyone who has one has an opinion that is 110% correct and everyone else is wrong. Saying that here is my .02 cents on the matter Instead of thinking water/air cooled discussion your search may be a little more daunting but your end result IMHO will be better. Look at either local or regional clubs, make friends make a list of either of the sorts you want then keep an ear out for the person who takes immaculate care of the car. Unless you are ready and wanting a big restore that will be the path of most happiness IMHO. Everyone I know that went this route gets to enjoy their vehicle. Now if you want a resto project stick with air cooled hands down.

[MC25]

I will say after having several 996s both .1 and .2, most of it is pure internet born hysteria. Find one with some miles on it, and drive it hard. with the age on most of these cars, chances are it would’ve experienced IMS failure by now. I absolutely love 996s, and my brother has a 996 C4S. Fantastic car for the price.

[88 PS190]

While there is certainly hysteria picking my local shop owner's brain he's seen quite a few with borescoring. His point was if you live where its cold you need to think about it and if you live where its warm just change your oil.

[d2jp]

While there is certainly hysteria picking my local shop owner's brain he's seen quite a few with borescoring. His point was if you live where its cold you need to think about it and if you live where its warm just change your oil.

The last shop I talked to about a PPI on a 996 told me he had M96s 996's "lined up like cordwood" waiting for new cylinder liners due to bore-scoring. This was a PCA recommended shop wih an excellent reputation and reviews. According to them, there are some engine design flaws....Lokasil coatings and plastic chain guides that just don't lend themselves to longevity. Factor in 10K mile oil change intervals and there is a reason the hysteria might be turning into a reality.

[88 PS190]

. Factor in 10K mile oil change intervals and there is a reason the hysteria might be turning into a reality.

Yes the new bore lining not great, and you should be changing oil every 3-5K miles even if it says 10K.

As it was explained to me the killers are revving up cold engines and letting cold engines idle. In the first case mechanically wearing the liner and in the second case rich fuel trim at idle when cold washing down the oil off the bore liners.

Along that train of thought are the people who replace the injectors to ensure they don't have drip and the people who install a thermostat to help the engine warm up. But again according to him when he checks with the owners people just expect a modern porsche to be just like their family mini-van. Start it in the driveway in winter and let it idle till warm and defrosted or be able to hop in the car and punch it down the street on their little commute to work. And to him if that's what you want to do then you should plan on replacing the cylinders.

[d2jp]

Yes the new bore lining not great, and you should be changing oil every 3-5K miles even if it says 10K.

As it was explained to me the killers are revving up cold engines and letting cold engines idle. In the first case mechanically wearing the liner and in the second case rich fuel trim at idle when cold washing down the oil off the bore liners.

Along that train of thought are the people who replace the injectors to ensure they don't have drip and the people who install a thermostat to help the engine warm up. But again according to him when he checks with the owners people just expect a modern porsche to be just like their family mini-van. Start it in the driveway in winter and let it idle till warm and defrosted or be able to hop in the car and punch it down the street on their little commute to work. And to him if that's what you want to do then you should plan on replacing the cylinders.

That is how it's been explained to me as well re: cold start/injectors, water pump and other neglected maintenance taking its toll. Fortunately there are a huge number of 996 and 997 varients on the market and even the most expensive/intrusive PPI with sump dropping and bore scope is still relatively cheap compared to an engine rebuild, and can give great insight into overall engine health. I've negotiated a couple of deals for '88s but have walked away b/c I've become distracted by a bright shiny water-cooled and the creature comforts it presents as a 'semi-daily' driver. Dream goal is save a little more for 996 turbo, eliminated at least the bore-scoring concern.

[MC25]

There is nothing like the driving experience of an air cooled 911. Sure it’s not fast, but I’m taking a G body/964 over a 996 all day long. My brother has an 87 G50 and I’ve got a 991.1, and it’s not even comparable to the feeling I get when I drive his car.