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-   -   Which Remanufactured Engine? (http://teamtalk.mastercraft.com/showthread.php?t=53547)

Bouyhead 04-11-2013 01:31 PM

Which Remanufactured Engine?
 
Might be in the market for a reman 351W Iv'e been looking at Jasper, Michiganmotorz, etc. Just looking for a little input if anyone has any expierience with any of the engine builders out there. Rapido Marine in FL. seems to be the cheapest? Looks like $1500 for a long block, all others seem to be in the ballpark of $2000-$2500

Thanks

Kyle 04-11-2013 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bouyhead (Post 924219)
Might be in the market for a reman 351W Iv'e been looking at Jasper, Michiganmotorz, etc. Just looking for a little input if anyone has any expierience with any of the engine builders out there. Rapido Marine in FL. seems to be the cheapest? Looks like $1500 for a long block, all others seem to be in the ballpark of $2000-$2500

Thanks

There is no difference between a marine and auto rngine except brass freeze plugs.

I bought a short block for $1000 cash with brass plugs. Then added gt40p heads.

The long blocks come with heads. Make sure that the heads are not a total pos.


Here is an idea. Buy a short block 351 $1,200 probably, then bada$$ heads for $500 then a cam for $250 and that includes lifters and push rods. Get a marine gasket kit for $100.

$2000-2100 and you have a real nice engine. Top it off with a Edlebrock performer intake $250 and you will have 330hp. I have cam spec card and you can use it to order a cam from comp cams. 2 week turn around.


A member at our club has a jasper long block in his '93 190 1:1 and it is very much lacking power. It has no balls.

You need the good heads.....period drastic difference.

$1500 vs 2000 and kicking yourself forever knowing that this was your opportunity to have lots of power is not worth the savings.

The heads on the long block reman engines suck.

You also mention might be in the market. Take your engine out and have it freshened for $900. If you have gt40 or gt40p heads the valve job and refresh is $200 or so.

$1,500 keeping your existing engine is way better than the jasper setup.

Just ask phntmski about his engine. He loves it. I built it. If you don't build it yourself you are still better off letting the machine shop build it.

mikeg205 04-11-2013 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle (Post 924226)
There is no difference between a marine and auto rngine except brass freeze plugs.

I bought a short block for $1000 cash with brass plugs. Then added gt40p heads.

The long blocks come with heads. Make sure that the heads are not a total pos.


Here is an idea. Buy a short block 351 $1,200 probably, then bada$$ heads for $500 then a cam for $250 and that includes lifters and push rods. Get a marine gasket kit for $100.

$2000-2100 and you have a real nice engine. Top it off with a Edlebrock performer intake $250 and you will have 330hp. I have cam spec card and you can use it to order a cam from comp cams. 2 week turn around.


A member at our club has a jasper long block in his '93 190 1:1 and it is very much lacking power. It has no balls.

You need the good heads.....period drastic difference.

$1500 vs 2000 and kicking yourself forever knowing that this was your opportunity to have lots of power is not worth the savings.

The heads on the long block reman engines suck.

You also mention might be in the market. Take your engine out and have it freshened for $900. If you have gt40 or gt40p heads the valve job and refresh is $200 or so.

$1,500 keeping your existing engine is way better than the jasper setup.

Just ask phntmski about his engine. He loves it. I built it. If you don't build it yourself you are still better off letting the machine shop build it.

So that marine cam and other internals is all BS - so marinizing is brass plugs, marine cooling system and a marined tuned ECU for TBI/MPI? I thought they some how beefed up a few things they claim (marketing) for the stresses of marine life? :confused:

Kyle 04-11-2013 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeg205 (Post 924233)
So that marine cam and other internals is all BS - so marinizing is brass plugs, marine cooling system and a marined tuned ECU for TBI/MPI? I thought they some how beefed up a few things they claim (marketing) for the stresses of marine life? :confused:

The cam has a certain lift and duration but the rest of the internals are not "beefed" up or made any different.

It is a huge marketing scam and is horse chit.

Indmar, PCM, crusader, etc took a auto engine put the marine cam and brass plugs in and badged a Chevy or Ford. It is a huge joke. Nothing inside such as crank, rods, pistons, bearings, oil pump, timing chain, etc are "marine". A marine cam only has a special lift and duration for mid range power. That is it.

mikeg205 04-11-2013 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle (Post 924241)
The cam has a certain lift and duration but the rest of the internals are not "beefed" up or made any different.

It is a huge marketing scam and is horse chit.

Indmar, PCM, crusader, etc took a auto engine put the marine cam and brass plugs in and badged a Chevy or Ford. It is a huge joke. Nothing inside such as crank, rods, pistons, bearings, oil pump, timing chain, etc are "marine". A marine cam only has a special lift and duration for mid range power. That is it.

Thanks...I love all this information here... :) -

FlyZone Costa Rica 04-11-2013 05:43 PM

Wish I knew more about all this. But I don't. So this
"Product Description:

New OEM Indmar Marine 350 5.7L Long Block. Get the real thing from Indmar. Don't get sold a automotive block that can't handle the RPM's we demand in our water sports boats. Marine blocks use high performance parts & have tighter tolerances because of the lower temperatures we run on our engines (160 degrees vs. 240). Using the wrong base engine can lead to performance loss and premature failure.
"
is bullsh1t you say, Kyle? (Source http://www.bakesonline.com/detail.aspx?ID=1749).

Not sure if you've seen (and possibly answered in this thread http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/...ad.php?t=53258
What would you recommend? Is a 351 easy to put in and make work with transmission and everything else?
Thanks for any advice!

[email protected] 04-11-2013 05:51 PM

I guess the additional hardened valve seats in the heads are not really needed

WOW...I wish I had known all this prior to becoming a dealer. I guess if it is on the internet it
is all real and truthful!.

So the starter, the alternator, the fuel delivery... all the extra safety stuff is all BS. I guess I will
go back to selling car carbs and save the folks a few bucks..and when something happens to them I'll just walk myself over to the jail!

mikeg205 04-11-2013 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [email protected] (Post 924334)
I guess the additional hardened valve seats in the heads are not really needed

WOW...I wish I had known all this prior to becoming a dealer. I guess if it is on the internet it
is all real and truthful!.

So the starter, the alternator, the fuel delivery... all the extra safety stuff is all BS. I guess I will
go back to selling car carbs and save the folks a few bucks..and when something happens to them I'll just walk myself over to the jail!

We weren't talkin' 'bout the starter, alternator, fuel delivery system or safety stuff .. ;) - valve seats hardened? On which heads? was there a i.e. Vortec Marine Head and an Vortec Automotive head? :confused:

Kyle 04-11-2013 07:34 PM

I guess my years of ASE certifications and knowing about tolerances don't mean anything.

We have one guy from a "Stealership" who sells "marine" engines. He makes a living selling marine parts and boats. Of course he would love to make a sale. Although he wants to beat down the accessories being marine vs automotive and that's not in the debate. Last time I checked we are disgusting engine internals (inside) and long/short blocks (both do not include accessories).

We also have another guy who is just trying to bust my balls saying marine engines have higher tolerances and automotive engines are slapped together loosely. Marine must be the only way to have tight tolerances.


Someone please show me

"Marine" specific

Block (besides brass plugs)
Rods
Rings
Pistons
Bearings cam and crank
Main caps
Push rods
Lifters
Cam
Oil pump
Timing chain
Timing gears
Head bolts
Main bolts
Intake bolts


I'll STFU when someone can show me marine specific parts. Until then people can keep fooling themselves with marketing.


I said the internals are the same and they are. These engines are cheap low HP engines built exactly like automobiles. Wanna talk about tolerances then build a BBC 572ci 980hp blown engine that has $30,000 in it. Then we can talk about the low rpm and low HP that are in these boats and compare the super bada$$ high quality race engine indmar made for this old boat.


Oh and for you guys doubting me. Get the ford part nubbers off of the head gasket and cross reference it to a felpro gasket part and notice that the non molested Ford indmar was an automotive gasket. Head gaskets were non marinized and were automotive but it was a high tolerance "marine" engine pushing a whopping 285hp. I have also been in several other indmar 351w non molested and they had the same automotive head gaskets. When I rebuilt mine I went back with a nice head gasket kit.

FlyZone Costa Rica 04-11-2013 07:47 PM

When I said
Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyZone Costa Rica (Post 924332)
Wish I knew more about all this. But I don't.

, that's really what I meant. I honestly know next to nothing about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle (Post 924370)

We also have another guy who is just trying to bust my balls saying marine engines have higher tolerances and automotive engines are slapped together loosely. Marine must be the only way to have tight tolerances.

So, I wasn't trying to bust any balls, but just comparing 2 pieces of info I have.
I'm looking for a replacement engine, and have thought about using an automotive block (which I can find locally) vs a marine engine (which I'd have to ship from the states). An automotive block would make life much easier, but I don't want to end up with a half assed product.

Therefore this thread has my attention and I genuinely asked for your opinion.
Let's keep the info coming!


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